Tinderbox Forum

About "good order list" of things to read for beginners

Dear Mark Bernstein and Anderson.
Dear All.
I am sure you are staying home to prevent coronavirus infection.
I was looking for something I could do at home at such a time.
Unfortunately, the TinderBox app isn’t as popular in Japan as you might think.It takes a lot of work to figure out how to use it.
Familiarity with the manual is essential to learn how to use it.
It is a manual that I want to read to understand the functions, but there is no Japanese version. etc. etc. etc.
Even when I look back at the path I have taken.
There is no manual for the Japanese version.
I think this is still the biggest bottleneck for users in Japan.
If there is a Japanese version of the manual, you can find the method or method you want to use by yourself.
In 2017, I was not sure if I should buy TinderBox or not, but what made me decide to buy it?
I had purchased WordProccessor and LaTeX apps to check their usability, but the last thing I wanted to do was TinderBox.
It was the only app I did not know how to use, and although I learned how to use it little by little while perusing the TinderBox v5 Manual,The TinderBox Way and Getting Starred with TinderBox by Mark Bernstein, I still felt that I was nowhere near the level of questions asked in the TinderBox Forum.
When I am over 70 years old, it became difficult to read the PDF text on the display screen in the original language. In order to change the environment for the better, I think it would be a good learning experience for the TinderBox master to create a “Japanese manual”.
I’m currently trying to translate aTbRef-8.tbx into Japanese, but
If you have a “good order list” of things to read for beginners
I would appreciate it if you could tell me.
Thx and regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

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As the author, if I can be of assistance in relation to aTbRef—for instance if certain phrases need clarification—I’m very happy to help. I have included a Google Translate into all the web pages which may be some help, but it is only machine translation so may be a bit inaccurate.

I think a problem for beginners is they want something that describes the app in terms of outcomes (annotating, making a timetable, etc.). However, much more useful is understanding how the app works: the basic building blocks, inheritance, prototypes, linking, export.

I’ve collated some sources here: https://www.acrobatfaq.com/atbref8/index/TinderboxDocumentationAn.html

If you haven’t already, looks at my illustrated tutorials here: https://www.acrobatfaq.com/tb_clarify/index.html, especially those on Inheritance and prototypes. If you don’t leverage those features, you are hardly using Tinderbox’s power to help you.

If you’ve more detailed questions, do ask (I’m busier than usual at the moment die to some COVID-related projects I’m assisting).

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Dear Mark Anderson,
Thank you for your Information.
Tinderbox tutorials [https://www.acrobatfaq.com/tb_clarify/index.html]
slipped my mind.
It was really kind of you to help me out like that.
Pardon the brevity of this note.
Thx and regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

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Creating a manual is certainly a good way reinforce learning to master many things.

Respectfully, though, I suggest you will learn more by creating your own personal manual (in Tinderbox of course) than translating whole books, sites, or other manuals. Thus you will capture your understanding of how Tinderbox can do what you want it to do, in your own thoughts.

Obviously, capturing parts of the English aTbRef into Japanese (or any language) is part of creating a personal manual. But you can find your own manual threading off in directions that are meaningful to you, relevant to your own note taking. And thus discover how to explain to yourself things that aTbRef does not delve into but which matter to you.

Just a thought.

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:+1: That’s how aTbRef started!

Dear Paul Walters
Thanks a lot.
I will go along with your suggestion.
I share the same view.
I will go through !
Until recently, I make a manual for reading impressions as “La Musique et l’Ineffable.tbx”.
La Musique et l’Ineffable , this book written by Vladimir Jankelevitch and I try to make as a Jankelevitch Manual with many musical resouces.
Jankelevitch, My maestro Marcel Moyse and I, are in a parallel direction with music.
I want to reach out for greater understanding of his musical world.
This aproach comes to an understanding of his musical and philosophical back ground.
And with ehich assist the process of digestion.
His book has staggering volume of information what we musician need to do and reevaluate life and value.
There are huge volumes of data and too many important considerations that I do not know ever as a proffesional musician.
If you have an interest in this La Musique et l’Ineffable.tbx, please let me know.
I will send you where you want or I will post on it this Forum.
Truly Yours. WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

A mistake has been found.
And with which assist the process of digestion.
( my miss spelling was ehich for “which” )
Thx and regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

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We would be more than happy (and honored) to share your translations with other Japanese users, if you would like that.

In the coming months, I hope as well to localize at least the menus in Japanese, Chinese, German, and perhaps French. Others are possible. Help with that would be most welcome, too.

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Dear Mr. Mark Anderson,
Most of your aTbRef-8.tbx are tranlated in Japanese.
It took about 3 days.
After most of the translations were done, I took a look at “Google Translate”.
The last time you wrote in the forum that I could use “google translate”,
So this was the thing.
Ever read a book in its original form. I’ve been running a lot.
I completely neglected to mention that I could learn from browser translation.
It is not hard to read the original words with a dictionary.
I still can not get rid of it because I have so much to learn.
Translation always depends on the “personal education” of the translator, so
from time to time, I come across “unconvincing translations”.

Now, I have a different question.
There is a column that says “Edicts”, but instead of this word
Is it possible to use the term “N.B (Nota Bene)”?
It is better to use a word that means “N.B” when referring to the Japanese word
I have a good seat, don’t I? How do you think about it?
Please give me your frank opinions.

Thank you for your cooperation.
Best regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

Terminology is a problem. For your translation, you may want to make an article on your choice of translation of certain Tinderbox terms, in case people use different translations in other places.

I suppose the word ‘rule’ was used in the meaning “this note must always obey this rules this code”. An ‘edict’ is a ‘rule’, but the difference is it runs less often. You might find it helpful to choose Japanese language words reflecting the purpose or intent of rules and edicts rather than trying to find a strict translation of the English word. As long as you explain to the reader, I think it may be more helpful.

But, I have no real experience with translating instructions. Perhaps someone else in the forum does have such expertise and can off better advice.

Whatever the outcome, thank you for your efforts on behalf of the Tinderbox community. :slight_smile:

Daer Mark Anderson,
Let me appreciate this first for your good offices.
Thanks a lot for your aTbRef-8.tbx.
When I was translating aTbRef-8.tbx this time, I was surprised by your detailed description and explanation.
At the same time, I would like to commend you for the enormous amount of work you have done and the hard work you have done.
This has given me a good guide to learning Tinderbox.app.
Could I ask for advice how could I get copy & paste for a link mechanics in the same page’s topical outlines ?
Sometimes, I can get this linkage only using copy & paste.
But offen I get dysfunctional link line-item.
Could not I have it any other way ?
Should I need to work consciously on every detail to cliate Link pop-over?
I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience.
With kind regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

If I understand correctly, you are asking: When pasting text that contains a Tinderbox text link, why the embedded links in the text only_sometimes_ shown up when the text is pasted? If that is the question, I’m not sure but I have reported this as it is a problem I have faced in recent maintenance of my aTbRef TBX.

If I have misunderstood, please ask again. I do appreciate we are working via translation, so please don’t apologies for the confusion that causes. Thanks you too, for your generous comments about aTbRef. It is there to help and I am glad that it is!

Dear Mr. Mark Anderson,

You bring up my problem as at the front you described.
You have also faced in your recent aTbRef TBX.
This is not the first time for us, is not it.
I hope Tinderbox will able to develope their behaviour, taking advantage of this occasion, and even beyond it’s ability.
I will turn in a report as thereunder.

Group A : Copy& Paste : up to the standard
(After Pasting, I can use it’s same behaviour.)
Make Web Link, acceptable level.
Group B : Paste : rejected
( I can not use this behaviour(only just unkinked item).)
Park Link, rejected
logical OR join , rejected
floor() nor round(), rejected.
format(data, “formatString”), this file should give a link address to Color.format page.
inside(“item”), this file should give a link address to contains(item)
Group B will be a growing trend from
[Full Operator List].

|= (logical OR assigment)
Setting an attribute to (no value)

With kind regards, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

I would love to have a look at this tbx, thank you in anticipation Wakamatsu-san.

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AS above, I have already reported the issue of links in pasted text to technical support.

I’m less clear about this:

This looks like a list of aTbRef article titles. What is the problem here?

Dear Mr. Mark Anderson,
I apologize to you in advance for the trouble that
I did not enough provide additional information on your aTbRef-8.tbx.
You will appreciate I will try to make better point out for about the Linkage.
Please show me my procedures’ fault.

When I put to kame link address to specific type of definition.
Exp. : floor(argument)
In this page, I click on [ceil()], this link Page is [ ceil(argument) ].
I pick up and copy this [ ceil(argument) ]address, then I return

[ floor(argument)] page, I pick up ceil() and chose from Note menu for Park Link with (Shift + cmd+L), paste [ceil() ] into their window inside.

Ususally we get link button on the right side. But nothing happen.
After this, I try to copy just [ ceil() ] from [ See also ceil() and round().] this line.
And copy next to [ ceil() および round()も参照してください。]
Now changing look like this. [ ceil() ceil()および round()も参照してください。]
(I will make this Font bigger for my explanation. )
2nd [ceil()] can have same behavior to jump to [ ceil(argument) ] page.
Then, [tound()] on the above in English sentences, I do the same thing copy from [round()] and paste in the next word [round()] in Japanese.
This time it does not get a jumping functional capability to round(argument) page.
This is one of my providing additional information on last e-mail.

Same occurrence of an event come up those pages.
logical OR join
format(data, “formatString”)
inside(“item”)
|= (logical OR assigment)
etc…
I would like to know why I can not get Link Button turn ON?
Sometimes, Link Parking Space window where I can find goal-oriented page in pull-down menu inside field.
I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience.
Respectfully, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

4 attached png files.

LinkParking-round(argument) LinkParkingSpace

There is no note called ‘ceil90’, you need to use the note’s name which is ceil(argument)’:

Monosnap 2020-04-29 10-46-56

If you specify the right note name in the parking space pop-up the link works.

Actually, easier is to scroll the view pane so can see the note about ceil() (whose exact $Name is ‘ceil(argument’) and drag from the link park onto the that note in the view and then complete the link.

Because not all names are unique in aTbRef I rarely use ziplinks (quick links) or the link parking pop-up shown above. Instead I always complete a not via/drag drop (in the aTbRef TBX, at least).

Also, do not assume link anchor text in note $Text is the title of the target note. In this particular document that is very rarely the case.

If in doubt as to where a text link points, use Browse Links to look at information about the link.

To illustrate may last point above, if we use Browse Links for note “round(argument)” we can see:

Link anchor test: “ciel()”

Link target $Name: “ciel(argument)”

Dear Mr. Mark Anderson,
I apologize to you in advance for the trouble,
I am afraid that even I have tried to copy from Brows Link.
It dose not work, sometimes, for me.
I am prepared for as many contingencies as possible from learned information, after my musical experience.
I have no hard data yet that is the reason why I ask for your advices, here.
Anyway, I will reexamine where X is Y, in your context.
Tanks a lot , taking time out of your hectic schedule to make a reply.
Respectfully yours, WAKAMATSU kunimitsu

I am sorry you are still having problems. I’ve just updated aTbRef notes (see here) to clarify the different function of the main link park and the similar-looking link widget on the text pane.

Is the problem that you can not find the full path ($Path) of the target note of some of my links? If ‘yes’, I have some more suggestions, but I’ll await you answer.